Yes! The past is full of crazy shit that people followed blindly.
-Slavery was ok for a long long time as they considered them not full humans. Nuts!
-Native Americans weren't considered full humans.
-Women were the property of men.
-Before the 80s doctors operated on babies without anesthesia, thinking that babies didn't feel pain. Somehow the crying didn't convince these fools!
-Neuroscience thought that the study of consciousness was a waste of time even up to the 90s!
These days, the Internet has broken the centralized media and social story that people used to follow.
We are in the end stage of Orwell's 1984, which he wrote about his experiences at the time.
We are in end stage IDIOCRACY, where corporations are gods. People are more distrusting of corporations and authority because they remember the crap they do.
The Milgram, rat park, and Stamford prison experiments were biased in favor of what the predator class expected of humanity. When the experiments were done in more realistic conditions, the results were different and less hopeless.
"Rat park" was evidently an experiment about drug addiction ... I think you might be thinking of the above.
I had to double check that, because I was pretty sure that the mouse experiment was performed with mice, and not rats. I am now really curious to know what the outcome would be for the same experiment if they did use rats and not mice ...
Yes, yup. They called the eventual breakdown of the normal order the "Behavioral Sink." For years now I have been calling the current state of the Humans' world The Sink after that experiment ...
"But when they re ran the experiment with some activities, the population plateaued and was mostly peaceful." -- I hadn't heard this part. Do you know what activities they gave to the mice? I don't think of mice as being a particularly playful lot ...
A running wheel and something else that I cannot recall. The mice regulated their population as they realized that having too many children would make the activities not available for some.
The original experiment was just food and water.
I tried looking for the paper or a website explaining it but these days search engines seem to focus on the established narrative which is the population bomb and chaos.
"The mice regulated their population as they realized that having too many children would make the activities not available for some."
I'm not doubting you per se, but this seems to be really remarkable if true.
In order for the mice to effectively regulate their population in this scenario, they would first have to make the connection between having sex and making babies. Under wild conditions, resource scarcity regulates this for them. Less food --> less nutrients for mama --> smaller litter size. They continue to have sex; it just isn't as fruitful. I believe that, if conditions get bad enough, libido sometimes drops as well ... But again, this is a basic biological feedback mechanism.
In a land of infinite resource abundance such as the experiment provided, the mice with the fun wheel would have had to make the connection between sex and offspring ... They would then have to have "judged" that the wheel was more "fun" than the sex! (Unless they had some super-effective method of mousey birth control ...)
He was pessimistic about tomorrow but optimistic about the day after tomorrow.
Well written piece on the dichotomy of man, machine and misaligned psychology.
The cause and effect paradigm with societal black mirror in everyone's hands makes for an interesting time. 7 billion whatever's and maybe 1 percent aware of consciousness. Everyone here for there own video game. Some of the people don't put any money into the video game. Some put no energy into it.
The video game industry is proof people would rather check out into fantasy than face 1 percent of truth.
It's self reference par excellence.
"
....Amo amas amat quid pro quo memento Mori ad infinitum. Sprinkle on a little bit of grated cheese and place under the griller until doomsday" Johnny 1992
Ok Sotiris. This is juicy and may be the piece of yours I disagree with the most and not harshly. There may be some blindness there.
This is a discussion I lol forward to.
I have a busy day with friends and family ahead of me.
I will give it a good read over since I read quickly (and tbh skimmed parts). If I feel the same after a closer look will let you know my (enlightened luddite) thoughts.
I have a good chuckle when I consider that idea of re-introducing conscription in the U.S.
It would amount to a wholesale failure, and maybe even civil war - stringing up bootlickers and statists alike. Again, due to exactly the reasons you have spelled out here. And the "authorities" are afraid - they should be because their time is up and the clock is ticking.
I'm pretty old I guess - a decidedly unlikely boomer. And one of my guilty pleasures is saying things or using words that would shock and dismay my counterparts in this age range.
I even purposely don't change words to avoid censors... let them ring out in their full glory LOL!
There IS greater freedom today in many ways. Now we just need to figure out a way to undo the control vectors. And it seems that is in the works.
So cheers to the younger generations. You make an old hippie proud.
Yes! The past is full of crazy shit that people followed blindly.
-Slavery was ok for a long long time as they considered them not full humans. Nuts!
-Native Americans weren't considered full humans.
-Women were the property of men.
-Before the 80s doctors operated on babies without anesthesia, thinking that babies didn't feel pain. Somehow the crying didn't convince these fools!
-Neuroscience thought that the study of consciousness was a waste of time even up to the 90s!
These days, the Internet has broken the centralized media and social story that people used to follow.
We are in the end stage of Orwell's 1984, which he wrote about his experiences at the time.
We are in end stage IDIOCRACY, where corporations are gods. People are more distrusting of corporations and authority because they remember the crap they do.
https://robc137.substack.com/p/the-milgram-experiment-and-how-we
The Milgram, rat park, and Stamford prison experiments were biased in favor of what the predator class expected of humanity. When the experiments were done in more realistic conditions, the results were different and less hopeless.
By "rat park," are you by chance referring to "Mouse Heaven?"
https://www.sciencehistory.org/stories/magazine/mouse-heaven-or-mouse-hell/
"Rat park" was evidently an experiment about drug addiction ... I think you might be thinking of the above.
I had to double check that, because I was pretty sure that the mouse experiment was performed with mice, and not rats. I am now really curious to know what the outcome would be for the same experiment if they did use rats and not mice ...
Oh yeah, I mixed up the names.
It was the experiment where they had infinite food and watched how the population grew until it became chaos.
But when they re ran the experiment with some activities, the population plateaued and was mostly peaceful.
Yes, yup. They called the eventual breakdown of the normal order the "Behavioral Sink." For years now I have been calling the current state of the Humans' world The Sink after that experiment ...
"But when they re ran the experiment with some activities, the population plateaued and was mostly peaceful." -- I hadn't heard this part. Do you know what activities they gave to the mice? I don't think of mice as being a particularly playful lot ...
A running wheel and something else that I cannot recall. The mice regulated their population as they realized that having too many children would make the activities not available for some.
The original experiment was just food and water.
I tried looking for the paper or a website explaining it but these days search engines seem to focus on the established narrative which is the population bomb and chaos.
"The mice regulated their population as they realized that having too many children would make the activities not available for some."
I'm not doubting you per se, but this seems to be really remarkable if true.
In order for the mice to effectively regulate their population in this scenario, they would first have to make the connection between having sex and making babies. Under wild conditions, resource scarcity regulates this for them. Less food --> less nutrients for mama --> smaller litter size. They continue to have sex; it just isn't as fruitful. I believe that, if conditions get bad enough, libido sometimes drops as well ... But again, this is a basic biological feedback mechanism.
In a land of infinite resource abundance such as the experiment provided, the mice with the fun wheel would have had to make the connection between sex and offspring ... They would then have to have "judged" that the wheel was more "fun" than the sex! (Unless they had some super-effective method of mousey birth control ...)
Murphy was an optimist.
He was pessimistic about tomorrow but optimistic about the day after tomorrow.
Well written piece on the dichotomy of man, machine and misaligned psychology.
The cause and effect paradigm with societal black mirror in everyone's hands makes for an interesting time. 7 billion whatever's and maybe 1 percent aware of consciousness. Everyone here for there own video game. Some of the people don't put any money into the video game. Some put no energy into it.
The video game industry is proof people would rather check out into fantasy than face 1 percent of truth.
It's self reference par excellence.
"
....Amo amas amat quid pro quo memento Mori ad infinitum. Sprinkle on a little bit of grated cheese and place under the griller until doomsday" Johnny 1992
Ok Sotiris. This is juicy and may be the piece of yours I disagree with the most and not harshly. There may be some blindness there.
This is a discussion I lol forward to.
I have a busy day with friends and family ahead of me.
I will give it a good read over since I read quickly (and tbh skimmed parts). If I feel the same after a closer look will let you know my (enlightened luddite) thoughts.
Let’s just say I’m wrestling with the ideas put forth here. Which points do you disagree with the most?
Views on the past a few details. Just read and took some notes.
Will give a more verbose and self aggrandizing response later.
Off to walk pups and homeschool.
I have a good chuckle when I consider that idea of re-introducing conscription in the U.S.
It would amount to a wholesale failure, and maybe even civil war - stringing up bootlickers and statists alike. Again, due to exactly the reasons you have spelled out here. And the "authorities" are afraid - they should be because their time is up and the clock is ticking.
I'm pretty old I guess - a decidedly unlikely boomer. And one of my guilty pleasures is saying things or using words that would shock and dismay my counterparts in this age range.
I even purposely don't change words to avoid censors... let them ring out in their full glory LOL!
There IS greater freedom today in many ways. Now we just need to figure out a way to undo the control vectors. And it seems that is in the works.
So cheers to the younger generations. You make an old hippie proud.